The answer to life the universe and everything

The answer to life the universe and everything

Recently one of Ergun's defenders challenged someone in the comment section of a blog to produce an example of Ergun saying "towel head".  Given Ergun's affinity (2001-2005, 2005-2010, 2010-2011) for using the word and his recent tweets, it was a silly challenge to make.  I have many more examples as does anyone with Ergun Caner media.

Warning satire follows:

Still in the spirit of Dr. Norman Geisler, I would like to pose a defense of Ergun Caner.

1. While speaking quickly on one occasion, Ergun accidentally jumped from his towel drying story to a joke about his bald head.  At least he didn't use other slurs.  This was hardly an attempt to say "towel head".
2. It is well known that Ergun Caner is a Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy fan.  When he said "towel head" he was actually making a reference to the most massively useful thing an interstellar hitchhiker can have.  You can even wrap it round your head to ward off noxious fumes or to avoid the gaze of the Ravenous Bugblatter Beast of Traal (a mindboggingly stupid animal, it assumes that if you can't see it, it can't see you - daft as a bush, but very ravenous).  Ergun regularly observes Towel Day.
3. This statement was intended as humor and was taken as such by the audience. Indeed, Ergun has made this joke for more than a decade and never once was it taken as a insult against Muslims. He was illustrating the misconceptions between Americans and Muslims.

This is too much to accept on faith

I have been thinking that Ergun's defenders seem to want us to take a lot on faith.  For example, here is Geilser's defense of Ergun claiming to have half-brothers.

7. Ergun claimed his father had many wives and two half-brothers and two half-sisters, but there is no evidence for the half-brothers.

Response: Ergun’s father did have two wives, having divorced the first one. He had three sons by his first wife (Ergun and his two brothers). So, Ergun has two full brothers and two step-sisters (from his father’s second wife). While speaking quickly on one occasion, he mistakenly called his brothers his “half” brothers. This is hardly evidence of an attempt to embellish or deceive. After all, he had the right number of each sibling, and he didn’t claim to have ten brothers or sisters!

According to Geisler the following examples amount to "one occasion".

June 2005

I came over during the Iranian crisis. Ayatollah Khomeini had taken control. The Shaw of Iran had been kicked out. And Ayatollah Khomeini said this, “We will not stop until America is an Islamic nation.” So in 1978, my father, my mother, my two brothers, my father’s other wives, and my half-brothers and sisters came to this country. How is it that Muslims can come to this country with other wives? Well it is called the Abraham lie. “This is my sister.” It explains our last names being the same. And so he would say, “This is my sisters.”

June 2005

I have half-brothers and half-sisters in Chicago in New York and in Turkey who live here who are still lost as geese still in the slavery of Islam. But I will not give up. How dare I give up. My father died in 99. His wives are still alive. How dare I give up. My half-sisters are still alive. How dare I give up. My half-brothers, my uncles, my aunts. How dare I give up. He didn’t give up on me. He didn’t stop. God didn’t stop hunting me down.

This is the picture that he is referencing

September 2006

This was my father, the one I spoke of yesterday, Acar Mehmet Caner. I am the second from him, that is one of my half sisters, one of my half brothers, and one other of my father’s children. I am the knock kneed child sitting there with my father. This was in Turkey. This was in Istanbul.

January 2009

My father had other wives. My father died in '99, never accepted Jesus. I have half-brothers and sisters who don't know Jesus. Here is why I am telling you this. Some of you, stepped over people on your way here this morning. People that have told you no a hundred times.

 I have tried not to accept things said about Ergun on faith.  However, these self proclaimed apologists who confront culture on the front lines demand that I accept that all four of these examples are just Ergun speaking quickly.  I just don't have that much faith.

Mother Smuggling and Ergun Caner - Again

OK, let me explain. No there is too much. Let me sum up. In Sweden, Acar Caner married Ergun’s mother. Ergun was born first in 1966. Erdem was born second in 1968. Then they picked up the family and moved to Ohio where Emir was born in 1970.

The marriage was troubled so Acar moved out around 1975. The divorce was finalized around 1978. Shortly thereafter, Acar remarried. He had two daughters from this second marriage.

Nobody disputes this. However, we saw in the first episode that in 2003, Ergun claimed the following

My mother found out late in her marriage that my father was married to more than one woman. I don’t want anyone else to deal with this.

Also, April 2005, there were these at Marine Corp Air Station New River

My father had more than one wife at a time. As you know the Quran says in Surah four that you are allowed up to four wives. My father had three.

And

We got stopped at the border, because my father had listed my mother as property. It’s true. And the guy said, “Your wife’s not property.” And he said, “of course she is.” Then he brought his “sisters” which is his other wives that’s how we bring in our other wives to America. We call them our “sisters”.

If these were all accidental misstatements, what are the odds that I can provide more examples? Let’s fast forward to the first weekend of June 2005. Ergun was preaching a conference at Ashburn Baptist in Chicago, Illinois. Remember the 2003 example?

My mother found out late in her marriage that my father was married to more than one woman. I don’t want anyone else to deal with this.

This is the same church. What are the odds that he will repeat that his father was polygamous. First, Ergun claimed to have grown up in Turkey.

What’s amazing is we keep finding out about each other that are so vastly different. We are the exact polar opposites. Don’t ever let anyone tell you that opposites can’t make it work. They can. Anybody else here who is married to a polar opposite? I mean an absolute, and it works somehow. Usually, it works, because the husband gives in, but on occasion. I have learned this, because we have lived even as Christians with misconceptions.

I had misconceptions about you. Even before I was a Christian, even before I came to America, even before I came to your country as a missionary of Islam. The only American television I saw was all I knew about America. I watched American baseball, from WGN here in Chicago. They somehow shipped it and we got Chicago Cubs baseball. I thought the purpose of American baseball was to lose, because every time I saw them play. This is Ron Santo days for all those Chicago Cubs fans.

I watched American football, I didn’t understand this, because if you pick it up, it is not a football anymore is it? I watched Dukes of Hazzard. I wanted to marry Daisy. I wanted to live in the Boars Nest. We watched Andy Griffith. Loved Andy Griffith, but I thought that all of America was Mayberry, and we came to America through Brooklyn, New York. But my favorite show came out of Georgia, because Atlanta, Georgia, small television station there was shipping its tapes to Europe and Turkey being half-Persian and half-European we would receive these tapes and they didn’t need to be translated and every two weeks, we got to watch Georgia Championship Wrestling and I thought it was real. Because nobody told me it was fake. And I thought Americans were tough. You guys got hit in the head with shoes and chains and you would get up again. I had misconceptions about you.

If you would like more examples of Ergun claiming to have grown up in Turkey watching American television you can click on this video. However let us get to some mother smuggling.

I came over during the Iranian crisis. Ayatollah Khomeini had taken control. The Shaw of Iran had been kicked out. And Ayatollah Khomeini said this, “We will not stop until America is an Islamic nation.” So in 1978, my father, my mother, my two brothers, my father’s other wives, and my half-brothers and sisters came to this country. How is it that Muslims can come to this country with other wives? Well it is called the Abraham lie. “This is my sister.” It explains our last names being the same. And so he would say, “This is my sisters.”

We settled in Brooklyn, New York, moved to Columbus, Ohio for the express purpose of what? My father was an architect and we built mosques. We would build mosques and my father in the mosque on Fridays, climbed to the top of the minaret. And there at the top of the minaret that long tower, he would begin, “[foreign language]”. The call to prayer. It’s my father’s job. It’s called a muezzin.

Ergun has no half-brothers. Do you remember Dr. Norman Geisler’s explanation for the half-brother claims?

Ergun’s father did have two wives, having divorced the first one. He had three sons by his first wife (Ergun and his two brothers). So, Ergun has two full brothers and two step-sisters (from his father’s second wife). While speaking quickly on one occasion, he mistakenly called his brothers his “half” brothers. This is hardly evidence of an attempt to embellish or deceive. After all, he had the right number of each sibling, and he didn’t claim to have ten brothers or sisters!

Obviously this was not Ergun speaking quickly. In his second to last sermon of the conference, he doubled down on both.

I have half-brothers and half-sisters in Chicago in New York and in Turkey who live here who are still lost as geese still in the slavery of Islam. But I will not give up. How dare I give up. My father died in 99. His wives are still alive. How dare I give up. My half-sisters are still alive. How dare I give up. My half-brothers, my uncles, my aunts. How dare I give up. He didn’t give up on me. He didn’t stop. God didn’t stop hunting me down.

Ergun knows that he has no half-brothers. He knows that his father was only married to one woman at a time. These sound like definite lies to me.

What are the odds that I can provide more examples of Ergun claiming his father was involved in mother smuggling?

Like this video if you like it and subscribe for more videos.

Sources

"20 Things You Must Know to Witness to a Muslim" - Ashburn Baptist Church - Chicago, Il - March 2, 2003 Link

"Base Theater" - Marine Corp Air Station New River - New River, NC - April 15, 2005 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

"Dr. Ergun Caner and the Teen Choir and Orchestra from the First Baptist Church of Jacksonville, Florida - A" - Ashburn Baptist Church - Chicago, Il - June 3, 2005 Link

"Dr. Ergun Caner and the Teen Choir and Orchestra from the First Baptist Church of Jacksonville, Florida - C" - Ashburn Baptist Church - Chicago, Il - June 5, 2005 Link

Music

The incredible remix of the Andy Griffith theme provided by MisterMasterMusic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfUMsaYkufk
"Test Drive" by Zapac http://ccmixter.org/files/Zapac/26047
"A year ago" and "Chords for David" by Pixt http://dig.ccmixter.org/dig?user=Pitx
"Gloria" by Snowflake http://ccmixter.org/files/snowflake/22692


Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/articles/ErgunCaner/

Next Script is Done!

I just wanted to make this point.  One, it is a relief to have the transcription done before making a video.  Two, I am pretty much just quoting Ergun.  Everything in yellow is a quote from Ergun or Norman.  My claims about Ergun are from his own lips. 

Translating one of God's most anointed expository preachers

2007:My Mom was divorced when my brothers became Christians. My Father left her, blaming her for our conversion.

2008:When my Mom got saved, because my father left her, because I became a Christian.

2009: You see, my Father left my Mom, because he blamed her that we got saved.

2011: My parents divorced, my Father blamed my Mom for our conversions.

The most obvious explanation for these four statements is that Ergun is trying to say that his father divorced his mother, because his father blamed his mother for their conversions.  However, Ergun, Emir, and Norman all teach that this explanation is the false one.  They all teach that since Ergun has claimed he never lied in his sermons this explanation must be false.  However, they have not said what Ergun was trying to say.

They seem to believe that Christians should be given the benefit of the doubt. For example, Ergun said the following in a speech to the Marines at New River.

(3:10) My father had more than one wife at a time. As you know the Quran says in Surah four that you are allowed up to four wives. My father had three.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M 

He even doubled down on the statement in the same speech.

(59:57) They have problems with immigration. I became an American citizen…uh…and stood up and took the vow and came in legally. We got stopped at the border, because my father had listed my mother as property. It’s true. And the guy said, “Your wife’s not property.” And he said, “of course she is.” Then he brought his “sisters” which is his other wives that’s how we bring in our other wives to America. We call them our “sisters”.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M 

He also repeated it in Hawaii in 2007.

(33:20) We got stopped coming to America, I can’t believe I’m telling you this, but I’m gonna. We got stopped coming to America in 1978. My father listed my mother as property on the manifest. Acar Mehmet Caner listed Monica Inez Caner, my mom, as property. And by the way, he came to America like many Muslims do with many wives, but polygamy is not allowed. It’s called the Abraham lie. Who knows what I’m talking about? This is my sister, that’s right. So my father had, he said, ‘This is my wife, Halah, and these are my sisters'. It explains the last name.

http://evangelism.fbcpearlcity.com/media/caner-mormonism-070601.mp3 

How does Ergun, Emir, and Norman explain these statements?  They argue that he was trying to say that his father divorced his mother and then remarried.  See they believe in giving the benefit of the doubt...but then there is this.

Oh well, so much for the benefit of the doubt.

Seriously it should scare you that these educators are teaching civilians, servicemen, and kids to think like this.  Scarily, smuggling wives across the border, becomes a divorce and remarriage.    

Ergun and Emir Caner and their Mom's divorce

According to Unveiling Islam, Dr. Ergun Caner’s parents’ marriage was doomed from the start. His mother was raised in Stockholm and educated all over Europe. His father was a Turkish immigrant with very different views. What is important here is that according to Unveiling Islam, Ergun’s parents divorced prior to their sons’ conversion to Christianity. There is a link in the description to the relevant portions of the autobiography.

The marriage was doomed from the beginning, a clash of cultures. Our mother was an only child, raised in Stockholm and educated all over Europe. By the time she was twenty, she had attended the Sorbonne in Paris, and had traveled the world. Father was from heartier stock. As the youngest child in his family, he had earned everything he owned and was steeped in Islamic culture. Their assumptions about marriage clearly clashed.

The divorce, which was finalized in America, was painful. As in most divorces, the children became the human “ropes” in a tug-of-war, torn between parents. A pattern developed of weekend visits between Columbus and Gahanna, in central Ohio. Yet even the wrenching experience of divorce could not prepare us for our father’s disavowal.

Entering high school, Ergun was a typical young man, except that he was a devout Muslim. Even through the divorce, our parents had maintained our rearing in the mosque. Each weekend, we would travel to Broad Street in Columbus, Ohio, where our father had helped found the Islamic Foundation. The mosque in Toledo was too far a drive, so the Foundation Center was established. Father did the call to prayer on occasion.

This was verified by divorce documents obtained by Jason Smathers. Ergun’s parents separated in 1975 and finalized their divorce in 1978. These documents are uncontested. In defending Ergun, Norman Geisler, noted:

Further, that Ergun was reared a devout Muslim is proven by his father’s testimony recorded in the divorce proceedings documents which ironically Ergun’s critic placed on the internet.

In another defense, he referenced the order of events. “After the divorce, he was raised by his mother who obviously had not disowned him since she was no longer a Muslim. But his Muslim father who had remarried did disown him.” Relevant portions are made available in the description below.

The Charge that His Family Did Not Disown Him When He Converted to Christianity as Caner Claimed that they Did.—It is true that after the divorce he was raised by his mother who obviously had not disowned him since she was no longer a Muslim. But his Muslim father who had remarried did disown him. This is the Muslim “family” to which he referred. This was very painful to him since he lived only a half hour away but could not even speak to him.

- In Defense of Dr. Ergun Caner: A Response to His Critics

OK, we all know the time line now. In 1975, when Ergun was about 8 or 9, his parents separated. In 1978, when Ergun was about 11 or 12, his parents divorced. Ergun later converted to Christianity somewhere in between 1981-1983, depending on which version of his story you go by. Emir and Erdem converted somewhere in between 1982-1984, depending on which version of their story you go by. The point is that the divorce took place 4 to 6 years prior to their conversions. Anyone who said otherwise would probably be lying. Cue clip from 2007.

If you are going to change the world, find you the Jewish equivalent of Bill Gates who can fund this movement. What ya talking to a poor person for? Strike four, she’s divorced. This Brittney Spears of the first century, five times, don’t you reckon after three or four she might think it’s her? Might be me?

Jesus said, “You answered correctly, five times, you had five husbands.” And in many churches, that’s the Scarlett Letter. Neither I have been divorced or my wife. Both our families have been through it. My Mom was divorced when my brothers became Christians. My Father left her, blaming her for our conversion. And when my Mom got saved, in 1991, there was nowhere she could serve, because our little church said that if you were divorced you can’t serve in any capacity. It is no longer the “Scarlett A”, but the “Scarlett D”.

Oh no! Surely there must be some other explanation for Ergun saying, “My father left her, blaming her for our conversion”. Come on guys! This is my 25th Ergun Caner video on this channel. You all know that I am going to provide multiple examples of Ergun making the same false statement over and over again. Then I will ask you which is more likely, that Ergun accidentally said his father punitively divorced his mother or that he said so purposely? So cue 2008. This clip was only five months later.

Strike four, she’s divorced. Jesus busts her, doesn’t he? He says, “You answered right.” “You’ve had five husbands.” This biblical Brittney Spears, has gone through husband after husband after husband. Don’t you think at some point she’d say, “Maybe it’s me?” But don’t you think that happens in the church all the time? We have sort of a new Scarlett Letter don’t we? My apologies to Hawthorne, but the big letter’s “D” now.

I’ve never been divorced. My wife’s never been divorced, but our whole family both sides decimated by it. And often in the church, the whispers the divorced hear, how, “Who are you?”

When my Mom got saved, because my father left her, because I became a Christian. When my Mom got saved, she couldn’t serve in the church where she got saved, because she was divorced. Jesus what are you talking to this divorcee?

This next clip is 12 months later. You will notice that I edited the clip with about a minute and a half before Ergun begins preaching on divorce. One, I like providing longer clips. They help you understand that I am not deceitfully giving gotcha moments. By all means, please listen to the unedited audio which I have linked to in the description below.

Two, I do hope you appreciate the irony. You will see what I mean in a moment.

Three, this is one of Ergun’s notorious youth events. These are teenagers that he is talking to. When I was a youth pastor, I wanted Ergun to speak to my youth group. By God’s grace, I am glad that he never did. Later on that day, Ergun will even tell the youth that at age 8, he was betrothed to a Turkish girl while he was still living in Istanbul, Turkey. Ergun, here, is lying to kids, kids that trusted him. How could he do this? Let us just cue clip 2009.

And we lie. Somebody asks you what kind of home you come from. Somebody asks you to tell the story. Somebody asks what’s your background? Somebody asks you what you struggle with. We lie.

Don’t you understand if God can get you through whatever it is that you are going through, that’s part of your story? And the reason that God kept you here to survive that was to help others who may be going through that? Don’t you understand that there are people you can talk to who would never listen to me? They would never show up to listen to a guy with a four hundred pound pumpkin head talk, but they will listen to you, because you have earned their trust. They will listen to you, if you tell them your story. Your scars become your story when you are willing to admit your weakness. That’s why he says, “We ain’t preaching ourselves, we preach Christ.” Your most effective witness will be before those people who know you, who know you and understand where you came from. Use whatever it is you deal with. Use whatever it is from which you came. Use it. Tell it. Be transparent. Don’t fake it and you will be astonished at the number of people who will listen to you. You have a story that God’s given you.

How many here, by a show of hands, come from a divorced background? Me too. We don’t talk about it, not in the church. That’s the new Scarlett Letter. I’ve not been divorced. My wife’s not been divorced. Everybody else in our family is. Not like our brothers, not Jill’s brothers, not my brothers. Our parents, Jill’s parents, her uncles and aunts, my uncles and aunts, everybody’s gone through it and when they come to church they feel like they got the “Scarlett Letter D”.

And so when I talk to those people and I say, “Let me tell you what my parents went through.” You see, my Father left my Mom, because he blamed her that we got saved. And those that come from a divorced background go, “I’m right there with you”.

In 2010, less than a year from the last clip, Ergun released his statement that he never intentionally misled anyone. I have provided so far three clips in which Ergun says he never intended for you to believe that his father divorced his mother due to her sons’ conversions. Do you buy that? You would expect with all the attention given to false statements like these; Ergun would stop making them in 2010. However you would think wrong. My next clip is from 2011.

My parents divorced, my Father blamed my Mom for our conversions. In 1991, with three boys as Christians, my Mom got saved, my Mom. My Mom is now remarried, a man from her discipleship group, who is now a supply pastor. Just got called to be an interim pastor, which is hilarious, which makes my Mom and an interim pastor’s wife. If you knew my Mom, you’d know how funny that was. Because if my Mom ever comes to your door, you’ll know it. Heavy accent, little woman, smoking, smoking, I mean chain smoking, pall malls unfiltered. “Filters are for wimps.” And she’ll do it witnessing. “I want to tell you about Jesus”.

Do you remember Ergun’s friend, Norman, who pointed out the divorce documents as proof that Ergun was a devout Muslim? Remember, he also noted that the divorce came before her boys conversion? Surely, he would correct Ergun? Nope, he’s right there.

Look if I had gotten married, if I ever show you a picture of Jill, she is a great godly woman, but my wife is hot, hot, hot. Like we stand side by side and people will go. All the time, all the time, Dr. Geisler will tell you.

The summer of 2010, he defended his brother saying, Ergun had demonstrated "unquestionable Christian character". This was just "a few incorrect statements". He said, "His character, integrity, and bold witness are truly an emulation of a shepherd's heart and an evangelist's passion." March 15, 2012, Emir referred to Ergun as "one of God's most anointed expository preachers".

I do not what you say, when one of your brothers lies publicly about your own mother. However, I definitely would not defend him as having “unquestionably character.” Perhaps, when someone lies about their mother, they are one of God’s anointed, but are they really one of God’s most anointed? Then again, does Emir even know?

Thanks for watching. Like the video if you like it. Subscribe for more videos.

Music 

"The Owl Named Orion" by danosongs.com 
"Light Banjo" by soundcloud.com
"Monster" by Peach Stealing Monkeys from PeachStealingMonkeys.com 
"The Bottom" by Josh Woodward from joshwoodward.com
 
Sources

Unveiling Islam Google Books

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/articles/ErgunCaner/

"Ergun Caner’s Secret Biography" Witness Unto Me - March 30, 2010
 http://www.witnessesuntome.com/2010/03/ergun-caners-secret-biography/

"Ergun Caner 2" 2007 NW Baptist Convention - November 14, 2007
http://audio.nwbaptist.org/2007%20NW%20Baptist%20Convention/Ergun%20Caner%202.mp3

“God’s Word,” The Downtown Church: Bellevue, WA – April 19, 2008 http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/gods-word/id321185342?i=113186322&mt=2

"Ergun Caner Saturday Morning" Northwest Baptist Youth Ministry Student Conference - May 29, 2009 http://audio.nwbaptist.org/2009%20Student%20Conference/Ergun%20Caner%20Saturday%20Morning.mp3
"Why I am no longer a Muslim" Mt. Airy Bible Church - May 7, 2011   https://vimeo.com/24514727

Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/articles/ErgunCaner/

Translating Ergun according to Dr. Norman Geisler :)

In my last video, there was a clip where Dr. Ergun Caner said the following.

My father was an Ulema in the mosque. An Ulema is a scholar. He was an architect by vocation. And when we came to America in 78, through Brooklyn, we settled in Columbus, Ohio to build mosques. That is exactly what my father did until the day he died, 1999. 

Now according to Dr. Norman Geisler any reference to Ergun coming to America in 1978 is a reference to him getting his citizenship in 1978. It is supposedly "well known" that Ergun became a citizen around the age of 11 or 12. So the fourth sentence should read:

And when we came to America obtained my citizenship in 78, through Brooklyn, we settled in Columbus, Ohio to build mosques.

I don't know, but regardless of what Norman says, that still sounds fishy to me. :)

Ergun Caner has huge eggs (huevos)

Warning this is a rant. If you are looking for a slow and well-reasoned argument, example by example watch my other videos.

Also Huevos is Spanish for eggs. It is a euphemism for something else… The comparable euphemism in English would be…

So this video will be PG rather than G.

However it will not be as bad as

Marine Corps Air Station New River, April 15, 2005

‘Um excuse me, why are you always picking on Canada?’ Because our Salvation Army could kick your *beep* if we wanted it to.

But more like

Marine Corps Air Station New River, April 15, 2005

…pants so tight that you can actually see the seam split the mangina.

On to the show

Reverend: They mocked the Lord too, didn’t they. And they smote him and they spat upon him and he turned to them his other cheek.
Other townsman: Look, Reverend, we don't want to smite 'em back. We just want to make 'em stop.

Ergun Caner has Huge Huevos

Let me sum it up for you.

After 9/11, a former Muslim wrote several books and delivered hundreds of sermons around the globe making false claims. In 2009, youtubers and bloggers began to acquire evidence: His father’s will, his parents’ divorce papers, his High School Yearbook, etc… In May of 2010, newspapers found these same documents and started debunking many of Ergun’s claims.

This is why Ergun has Huge Huevos

If I was debunked by the associated press in USA Today, I would stop making the same claims. Since Liberty University’s investigation, I only have 13 interviews, sermons, and lectures from 2010, 2011, and 2012. Still every time, when he mentions when he was converted , he claims he converted in his senior year.

Mt. Airy Bible Church, May 7, 2011

…my senior year…

Canyon Creek Baptist Church, July 31, 2011

…my senior year…

C3 Church, January 1, 2012

Finally going into my Senior year, I decide, ‘You know what? I’ll show you.’ And I went, I walked, I said ‘alright, I’ll come, come, come I’ll come.‘ And I walked into the Stelzer Road Baptist Church in Columbus, Ohio, right near the airport.

Fortress of Faith, June 4, 2012

…in my senior year in High School…

Wealth of Prophecy, July 30, 2012

…my senior year in High School…

Ergun Caner has Huge Huevos

Ergun was born November 3, 1966. His 18th birthday was November 3, 1984. His Senior year was 1983-84. Emir claims that he was saved a year after Ergun, November 4, 1982, the day after Ergun's 16th birthday. The oldest that Ergun could have been converted was 15 years old and a Sophomore in High School. Google it.

Ergun Caner has Huge Huevos

He is still claiming that Jerry Tackett pursued him for four years, during his Freshman, Sophomore, Junior, and Senior year.

West Cabarrus Church, July 18, 2010

One boy, one boy heard from God. Jerry Tackett. And when nobody believed him and when he kept coming and I kept telling him, ‘no’, Freshman year, Sophomore year, Junior year.

Mt. Airy Bible Church, May 7, 2011

Jerry Tackett kept coming after me. Every time I said, ‘no’, he found another way to ask. Freshman year, Sophomore year, Junior year in High School, going into my Senior year, finally I said, ‘You know what?’ ‘Why don’t you stop?’

Canyon Creek Baptist Church, July 31, 2011

Jerry Tackett saw me isolated. Started my freshman year and wouldn’t quit until my senior year.

C3 Church, January 1, 2012

Jerry Tackett hunted me…Freshman year…Sophomore year…Junior year.

Fortress of Faith, June 1, 2012

Well, it was a young man, I started as a Freshman in High School and his name was Jerry Tackett, from Columbus, Ohio. And there in High School, this young man, he did something that I find extraordinary these days. He didn’t take the first, ‘no’ or the second, ‘no’. He kept coming for three years.

Fortress of Faith, June 4, 2012

Yeah a few times, for three years, I told him, ‘no’. I didn’t want to hear anything about the gospel. I was, we were very devout Muslims. We lived in Columbus. My father was building the mosque that eventually came on Broad Street. We wanted nothing to do with you as Christians. If you can say openly hostile, maybe passively hostile however you want to say that, I wanted nothing to do with this guy, but he wouldn’t quit. You know, again how many of us, if we share the gospel and somebody says ‘no’ we move on. There was no moving on. He kept coming and finally going into my Senior year in High School, I decided I’d take him up on his challenge.

Wealth of Prophecy, July 30, 2012

That was it. It was the testimony of one boy named, Jerry Tackett, a Kentucky boy, a matter of fact. His Dad was an old Kentucky man who had gotten saved. Jerry Tackett, just would not give up on me. Jerry Tackett started when I was a Freshman in High School and continued coming after me all the way until our Senior year in High School.

Again the oldest Ergun could have been converted was 15 years old and a Sophomore in High School. The most Jerry could have pursued him was two years.

He is still claiming his brothers converted when he was in college.

Mt. Airy Bible Church, May 7, 2011

A year later, I’m in college. I was getting something that I didn’t deserve. Every day I get something that I don’t deserve. Every day. I find out both my brothers got saved.

Canyon Creek Baptist Church, July 31, 2011

A year later, I am in college and I find out that God has met my boys at the well, both my brothers got saved. Somebody shared the gospel with them, and someone shared the gospel with me.

C3 Church, January 1, 2012

We ain’t got time. We ain’t got time. We got to go. But really quick, year later, I’m disowned. A year later, I am studying for the ministry. I lose my family and I find out my church is my family. Both brothers got saved.

According to Unveiling Islam, Erdem converted less than a year after Ergun's conversion. Emir converted November 4, 1982 a year after Ergun's conversion during the fall of Ergun's Junior year of High School.

This is one of two claims that caught me by surprise. If he converted as a High School Senior, the logical inference is that he was a High School graduate a year later when his brothers converted. When I first started researching, I never thought he would actually claim so and claim so, often.

Ergun Caner has Huge Huevos

After everything he continues to claim his father divorced his mother, because he and his brothers converted to Christianity.

Mt. Airy Bible Church, May 7, 2011

My parents divorced, my father blamed my mother for our conversions.

Ergun's parents’ divorce was finalized in 1978, at least 2-3 years before Ergun's conversion. This is the second claim that caught me by surprise. I often wondered why Ergun did not mention his parents’ divorce in any of the sermons that I had listened to so far. I was shocked when I found three sermons where he made these false claims.

Now, I will be the first to admit that I only have 13 samples of Ergun speaking from the beginning of Liberty University’s investigation till today. In every example, when he makes a claim about his conversion in High School or his parents’ divorce he gets it wrong. His defenders want me to believe that this is a non-representative sample. OK? Then why would all the examples, available on the internet, be biased towards him making false claims? If Ergun making false claims was the exception, not the rule, the sample should be biased towards him making true claims.

His defenders want me to believe that these examples are only misstatements. Again, why would all the examples, available on the internet, be biased towards misstatements? Furthermore every one of these false claims has been made by him multiple times throughout his post 9/11 career. If these really were misstatements, wouldn’t you expect an anointed man of God to stop after having been corrected on a national level?

Also it takes big huevos to continue to accidentally say your father divorced your mother because he blamed her for your conversion. It takes big huevos to continue to accidentally say that your brothers converted while you were in college.

Really? You expect me to believe that Ergun just can’t get his story straight? Links to the unedited clips are available in the description. What do you think he meant?

I, for one, think that this is clear evidence of him lying through his teeth. He knows his life story. He lived it. Still after everything, he continues to misrepresent it. Still after everything, pastors, teachers, and event organizers continue to invite him to lie to you.

Look, Reverend, we don't want to smite 'em back. We just want to make 'em stop.

Mt. Airy Bible Church, May 7, 2011

My wife is hot, hot, hot. Like we stand side by side and people will go. All the time, all the time, Dr. Geisler will tell you.

Music

"Stickybee", "I Want to Destroy Something Beautiful", "Oh Mallory", and "The Bottom" by Josh Woodward from joshwoodward.com

Sources:

Unveiling Islam Google Books

"Ergun Caner’s Secret Biography" Witness Unto Me - March 30, 2010
 http://www.witnessesuntome.com/2010/03/ergun-caners-secret-biography/

"Christian leader faces questions about Muslim past" USAToday - May 21, 2010 http://www.usatoday.com/news/religion/2010-05-21-christian-muslim-preacher_N.htm

"Will you be a Rhoda?" West Cabarrus Baptist Church - July 17, 2010 http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/will-you-be-rhoda-acts-12/id543653965?i=117940158&mt=2

"Why I am no longer a Muslim" Mt. Airy Bible Church - May 7, 2011   https://vimeo.com/24514727

“The Samaritan Woman” Canyon Creek Baptist Church – July 31, 2011 http://www.canyoncreekbc.org/resources/online-media.html?controller=studylist&task=download&study=13&media=0

“New Years Day Service” C3 Church: Clayton, North Carolina – January 1, 2012 http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/new-years-day-service-special/id125373478?i=109068443&mt=2

"Interview with Dr. Ergun Caner Part 1" Fortress of Faith - June 1, 2012 http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/interview-dr.-ergun-caner/id486946417?i=116478388

“Interview with Dr Canner Part 2 – Audio” Fortress of Faith – June 3, 2012 http://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/new-years-day-service-special/id125373478?i=109068443&mt=2

"Ergun Caner Interview" Wealth of Prophecy - July 30, 2012 http://youtu.be/xMitUZkZImg

Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/articles/ErgunCaner/

When does Norman Geisler think Ergun's parents divorced?

Ergun Caner - Why I Am Not A Muslim from Mt. Airy Bible Church on Vimeo.

May 7, 2011, Ergun spoke to Veritas Seminary.  Norman was present.  Around a half hour into the lecture, Ergun said the following.

My parents divorced, my father blamed my mother for our conversions.

Ergun's parents' divorce was finalized in 1978.   Ergun's conversion was at the latest the Spring or Summer of 1982. The divorce was at least three years before his conversion.  Norman knew this.  Almost a year earlier, Norman wrote.

The Charge that His Family Did Not Disown Him When He Converted to Christianity as Caner Claimed that they Did.—It is true that after the divorce he was raised by his mother who obviously had not disowned him since she was no longer a Muslim. But his Muslim father who had remarried did disown him. This is the Muslim “family” to which he referred. This was very painful to him since he lived only a half hour away but could not even speak to him.

When Norman redid his website, In Defense of Ergun Caner, did not make the transition. However, the above quote shows that Norman knew the timeline, yet Ergun lied to his face. What a friend we have in Ergun.

PS ~ I have at least three more examples of this same lie.  If you believe that this is a misstatement, how do you misstate something like this?

Canyon Creek Baptist Church 7/31/2011

Ergun mostly claims in his sermons that he was a High School Senior when he converted in 1982.  Ergun's Senior year was 1983-84, so he was not a Senior in 1982.  However, he and his brothers claim Erdem and Emir converted about a year after Ergun.  (Emir's conversion is even dated November 4, 1982.)  The logical inference of his brothers converting a year after his Senior year, is that Ergun had already graduated by that time.  Until recently, I only had two examples of Ergun directly claiming to have been in college during his brother's conversions.  (These are going to be mentioned in an episode of "Does Emir Know?".)  Recently, FBCWatchdog encouraged me to listen to Ergun's post scandal sermons and I found this one from Canyon Creek Baptist Church, July 31, 2011.

(32:50) “I moved to this country isolated from you as a Muslim. I looked different. I worshiped a different god. My father devout in the mosque, we build mosques like missionaries to you.

I want nothing to do with you people. I hate the Christians. I assume you hate me back.

I go into high school at Gahanna Lincoln High School, Gahanna, Ohio; isolated. One boy met me at my well. It wasn’t a guy on TV. It wasn’t somebody famous. It wasn’t TBN. It wasn’t Christian radio. It wasn’t somebody with purple hair crying purple tears. It wasn’t somebodies name who was on the side of a book or the side of a building, because I would have paid no attention to any of that.

You know who reached me for the gospel? One high school kid who wouldn’t shut up. Jerry Tacket saw me isolated. Started my Freshman year and wouldn’t quit until my Senior year. Invited me to everything, hotdog hogouts, pizza pig outs, ‘lock ins’.

‘Lock ins’. I would do a hotdog thing in a heartbeat, but ‘lock ins’ are of the devil. Three o’clock in the morning you want to stay up and do something. I want to sleep at three o’clock in the morning, instead of finding kids hiding in stair wells, praying together.

I said no to everything. He didn’t quit. I want you to think about the people that you love the most that don’t know Jesus yet. You invited them. You’ve prayed for them. You’ve loved them. You’ve brought them. They may have come to an cantata. They came to a special Sunday. They’ve come to a number of things then they started making excuses. They didn’t want to come anymore. Then after a while that they don’t even make excuses. They just don’t want to come. They maybe even make fun of you for coming. You love them. I know. You pray for them to be saved. I know, but after a while you stop inviting, because you know what they are going to say.

Here’s the deal. How many times we knock on a door. Jack Chick track in our hand. ‘Hey I’d like to invite you to’ Boom! Door slams. What do we automatically do? ‘Huh, he must not be one of the elect.’ I scratch him off my list and move to the next house. ‘Heathen!’ Not Jesus and not Jerry Tacket. He kept coming. Every time I said, ‘no’, he found a way to bring up a ‘yes’. He just kept coming. In my Senior year, when I finally decided, you know what, I’ll show you. I walked into the Stelzer Road Baptist Church in Columbus, Ohio, right near the airport."

As usual, he clearly stated that he converted during his Senior year.  As usual, he also stated that Jerry Tacket pursued him for four years: Freshman year through Senior year.  The next part is not so usual.

(43:35) "A year later, I am in college and I find out that God has met my boys at the well, both my brothers have got saved. Somebody shared the gospel with them, and someone shared the gospel with me."

As I mentioned above this is unusual.  I have only found this claim in two other sermons. I am surprised that only a year after Geisler defended him, Ergun would pull out this whopper, especially since Unveiling Islam claims that Ergun was the one who invited Emir to church. 

Listen for yourself. The sermon is available here: http://www.canyoncreekbc.org/resources/online-media/teacher/7-ergun-caner.html

My Promise about Ergun Caner

I kept forgetting the exact details of what I pledged, so about a year ago, I decided to make a video.

If Ergun Caner and Norman Geisler will post a written apology/retraction of Ergun denying he lied to those marines, I will delete all videos about him. I will post a new one proclaiming his repentance. 1 2

When I made that pledge, I had not listened to as many of Ergun's sermons as I have now.  Before August 2010, I had listened to him in Convo, Campus Church, and Seminary Chapel.  I did not remember him making any of the statements that he supposedly made in the edited youtube videos.  Thanks to Jason Smathers and  Turretinfan, I became aware of the Marine videos. Even though, I was convinced that I could prove that Ergun lied, April 15, 2005, I did not think that I could prove that he lied any other day.  Even with prompting from Ergun defenders, I tried to stay with what I felt I could prove.  At the time, I thought Moses Model was done making Ergun videos.  Edited videos never convinced me and the only unedited sources I had were Marine videos on viddler.  There are only so many ways you can remix that material. In an argument with another seminary student on twitter I conceded that I would remove my videos if the two conditions above were met.

According to this seminary student, Ergun admitted he lied to a private group at Thomas Road, September 2010.  Supposedly, he told this private group that he did not wish to apologize publicly, because of how the bloggers would react.  The student urged me to take this anecdote as evidence of repentance and evidence that I biblically needed to remove my videos.

This was insufficient for many reasons.  First, the Marine videos had pressed on me the limitations of anecdotal evidence.  I needed more than an esoteric anecdote that Ergun did not even want me to know about.  The extremely amateur videos that I produced were sourced by hours of unedited video footage.  I did not rely on anecdotes to accuse Ergun of lying.  Reasonably, I should not rely on anecdotes to accuse Ergun of repenting.

Second, Ergun seemed to be trying to have it both ways.  After all, he wrote on the internet that he did not intentionally mislead people.  Internet magic meant that though he published once, it was read over and over.  Even though his printed lies were removed from his website, they were archived at SBCToday and viewed and copied several times. Even if Ergun repented privately at Thomas Road, it was/is more likely that someone believed his public printed lies about his honesty rather than heard about the private repentance of those same lies.

Third, Ergun's friends were not under the impression that he had needed to repent of lying.  A mutual  friend that I and Ergun share posted his "apology" to facebook.  Though I do not remember if it was after September, this person had posted Norman Geisler's defenses prior.  If Ergun was repentant, why did he not correct this person and Norman?  Why did he let them continue to maintain that he never lied?  May 2011, Marine evangelist Tim Lee said that the Liberty committee "never once found that he [Ergun] lied."  If Ergun repented, how did Tim not know?  In Ergun's shoes, I would not let my friends continue to defend me.

Since during the summer of 2011, I could only prove that Ergun lied April 15, 2005, I only pledged that Norman and Ergun must apologize for Ergun's lies that particular day to those Marines.  A year later, I can prove so much more and have listened to hours of Ergun's sermons (mostly cataloged by Turretinfan, BibleWheel, Babylonian Squirrel, and James White). A year later, Ergun still publicly maintains he did not intentionally mislead people. He continues to lie by letting his printed lies stand.  A year later, Ergun is still bearing false witness in churches.

Still a year later, (assuming that this seminary student will not release me from my word) I will remove all my Ergun Caner videos from my youtube channel if only Ergun and Norman will admit that Ergun lied that day to those Marines.  Ergun, if you want Moses Model to leave, all you need is a pint of honesty.

Update 6/14/14 

Last June, Ergun and I had the following email exchange about the post.  I promised to keep the exchange off the internet, but now since the exchange has been submitted as evidence in the lawsuit, I want to update the post to at least give Ergun's claims some air time.

5. On your blog you state an LU high official told you that Caner "privately repented at Thomas Road Baptist Church," but that he was afraid to do so publicly because of the bloggers. Caner would like the name of this “high official.” If a name is not provided, then please publicly state that the statement was not made truthfully.

I do not believe that I stated that any "high official" told me these things. This is what I wrote:

“According to this seminary student, Ergun admitted he lied to a private group at Thomas Road, September 2010. Supposedly, he told this private group that he did not wish to apologize publicly, because of how the bloggers would react. The student urged me to take this anecdote as evidence of repentance and evidence that I biblically needed to remove my videos.”

The seminary student was Phil Shouse who tweets under the handle @philshouse. He used Tweetdeck to extend his tweets so a lot of our conversation is lost. I remember him saying that Ergun repented at Thomas Road Baptist Church and was afraid to do so publicly because of the criticism he would receive from bloggers. This conversation was held publically on twitter May 24, 2011. Later, Phil blocked me on twitter for my criticism of Ergun.

I fully acknowledge that I maybe misremembered the rumor that I was told.  JD Hall has an email claiming that Ergun repented to the board, not at Thomas Road. Even though I never said "high official, Johnny Hunt would count as a "high official".  Also if you read the post, I was very dismissive of the anecdote.

A couple of things need to also be noted.  To the best of my knowledge, I have never misquoted Ergun, but here Ergun misquoted me.  Further, Ergun demands the benefit of the doubt for all of his factual statements that were self-contradictory, but he asks me to "publicly state that the statement was not made truthfully".  If Ergun will not give me the benefit of the doubt, why is it reasonable for me to give him the benefit of the doubt?

Further Ergun has slandered me now multiple times in this lawsuit.  The most glaring example is last April when he said that I worked for him and he fired me.  This week, he now claims that he had no prior knowledge of me before filing the lawsuit.  Given how much back and forth, Ergun and I have had about my relationship with him, both statements cannot reasonably be made truthfully.  Given that they are the definition of self contradictory, together they cannot both be held honestly.

Ergun's self righteous baloney that preaches do as I say, but not as I do; is the definition of hypocrisy.  I honestly wonder what faith that someone can hold that they still consider Ergun an honest man.

Ergun Caner: Does Emir Know? - Introduction

Welcome to another episode of "what are the odds".  Many have wondered about Emir Caner's position on his brother's fabrications.  The summer of 2010, he defended his brother saying,  Ergun had demonstrated "unquestionable Christian character".  This was just "a few incorrect statements". 

"His character, integrity, and bold witness are truly an emulation of a shepherd's heart and an evangelist's passion."

March 15, 2012, Emir referred to Ergun as "one of God's most anointed expository preachers". Now to be fair, Emir never said that Ergun did not lie or did not intentionally mislead people. However calling his brother a man of "unquestionable Christian character" seems to suggest Ergun did not lie.  Here is the problem, Ergun has lied about Emir.  Does Emir know this?  Maybe not. 
Let's explore the issue. 

To understand this first video you need some background.  Unveiling Islam authored by Ergun and Emir, explains Ergun's brothers' conversions this way. 

"Ergun's brothers, however, listened.  Erdem accepted Christ in the basement of their home.  Ergun then invited Emir to a revival service the following year.  There, for the first time in his life, Emir heard that God loved him and desired to have a personal relationship with him.  Though he had been to church before, this was the first time he could recall hearing a preacher speak openly and honestly about the exclusivity of the Gospel.  Only through the blood of Jesus, spilt on the cross, can someone be saved.  Yet the preacher also spoke compassionately about God's desire to save everyone.

Although there was only one way, the path was open for all who would believe.  On November 4, 1982, Emir was born again." 

Simple enough.  Erdem accepted Christ in their basement.  Ergun invited Emir to a revival service the following year.  November 4, 1982, a Thursday, Emir was born again.  The story seems simple to tell.  Ergun however in at least two instances will get the story horribly wrong.  I will let you decide if it was intentional or not. 

Let me set the next example up for you.  Ergun had already claimed a myriad of false things. He said he came to America in 1978 and he was 14 in 1978. Yet he really came to America before August of 1970.  He turned 12 in November 3, 1978.

Next Claim: He was a High School Senior in 1982 with the implication of being near college age, 18 years old. Again this is wrong.  Ergun graduated with the class of 1984.  He ended his Sophomore year in 1982 and began his Junior year that fall.  He turned 16 in November 3, 1982. 

All of this will be handled in greater detail in a later video.  Yet you needed the greater context of the main clip.  Here Ergun claimed that he converted in November 4, 1982. November 4, 1982?  Why does that sound familiar?  Oh yeah, that was the day that Unveiling Islam says that Emir was saved.

What are the odds?

He claimed that he was thrown out of his house post-conversion and had to live in garages and basements.  Ergun's mother had primary custody of Ergun and his brothers since the divorce.   His father only had partial custody.  When his father disowned him, Ergun did not have to live in garages and basements. 

Both of Ergun's brothers were not saved after he preached a seven minute sermon...at least not according to them.  Ergun said some things that were grossly false.  While you ponder if this was an intentional or unintentionally, perhaps you should wonder "does Emir know?" 

If Ergun never intentionally misled anyone, what are the odds that I can provide other examples?

Sources:

Unveiling Islam http://books.google.com/books?id=HJJ0posDfDUC&lpg=PA17&vq=erdem&pg=PA19#v=snippet&q=erdem&f=false

General Session #2 - Dr. Ergun Caner -- June 1, 2007 http://evangelism.fbcpearlcity.com/resources.html

Music:
"Monster" by Peach Stealing Monkeys from PeachStealingMonkeys.com
"Spanish Summer" and "Rags 2 Riches Rag" from AudioNautix.com
"The Bottom" by Josh Woodward from joshwoodward.com

Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/insupportofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/infurtherdefenseofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/indefenseofcaner.html

Ergun Caner is speaking at En Fuego 2012

"En Fuego is Spanish for "On Fire". Ergun Caner is going to speak at En Fuego 2012, the largest Christian Music Festival.

"En Fuego is Spanish for "On Fire". The event is a one-day rally where students from every denomination and background come together for the purpose of worship and seeing Jesus Christ change lives. An outdoor event, the rally has a very intense yet intimate camp-like feel and some have referred to it as 'the Christian Woodstock of your generation.'"

Perhaps En Fuego 2012 does not know Ergun lied to our countries heroes.  Ergun Caner should apologize to those Marines. En Fuego 2012 should not allow him to speak until he does.  As "a worship experience for believers and an evangelistic outreach for the lost", this does not seem like too much to ask. Some might say that a Christian minister like Ergun Caner, would never apologize for lying to our Marines.  I say God is great.  God also can do great things through his worshipers.  As always the unedited videos are provided in the video description.  Also, you can click on the annotations. 

Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. ~ John 14:13

I can do all things through Him who strengthens me. ~ Philippians 4:13

Music: "Chords for David" "See you later" both by Pixt
http://dig.ccmixter.org/dig?user=Pitx

Cited Links

En Fuego 2012, August 25, 2012
http://www.enfuegoinfo.com/

En Fuego FAQ
http://www.myspace.com/enfuegoinfo/blog/536018841

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/insupportofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/infurtherdefenseofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/indefenseofcaner.html

Probably my only Ergun Caner gibberish video

Like many of you, I do not speak Arabic, Turkish, Pashto, Dari, or Farsi,.  When speakers of these languages say that Ergun was speaking gibberish; there is little way for me to tell.  However there is one phrase that Ergun has repeated at least three times: April 15, 2005; June 2, 2007; and February 28, 2008.

If he is really quoting a foreign language, one should expect the quote and translation to remain the same over the years.  They sound nothing alike.  Even if he made quoting errors over the years what are the odds that I discovered the only three examples that do not line up?   If you have any other examples, I would be glad to listen to them.

Do they sound the same to you? Skeptics are welcome.

The April 15, 2005 clip can be found here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

The June 2, 2007 clip can be found here.  It is the second Islam lecture
http://evangelism.fbcpearlcity.com/resources.html

The February 28, 2008 clip is from Ergun's Rick and Bubba interview.  The links have recently gone dead.  I will try to get the interview up.  In the mean time, I can email you the interview.  You can request the mp3 at Mosesmodel@yahoo.com

Music:

"Monster" by Peach Stealing Monkies http://www.peachstealingmonkeys.com/music/

"A Year Ago" by Pixt http://ccmixter.org/files/Pitx/11068

Also I owe the authors of two youtube videos for a lot of the information in this video. First, "frizzleyfrozzle" was the first one who pointed out that Ergun had gave two different phrases with the same translation.


Also James White's "Ergun Caner and Arabic: A Review" has been the best thing that has been done on Ergun's "Arabic".



Also, while I cannot cite a specific video, we all owe a debt to Mohammed Khan who first pointed out Ergun's inconsistencies and gibberish.

PS ~ My video has been mirrored by a MCDebate.  The mirror has not been labeled a mirror or attributed to me.  The title, "Ergun Caner, Fake Ex-Muslim Evangelical Leader Speaks Gibberish In Order to Fool His Audience", is not something that I endorse.  I may hypothesize that it is true, but unlike many that I have cited above, I cannot prove.  I speak none of the possible languages.  Update 8/27/12 - MCDebate has apologized and attributed the video to me. 

Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/insupportofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/infurtherdefenseofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/indefenseofcaner.html

Is Norman Geisler calling Ergun Caner a liar?

This is just a small sample of Ergun saying he came to America in 1978.  Ergun came to this country before August 1970.  Ergun maintains that he never intentionally mislead anyone.  How does Norman Geisler reconcile this?  Norman states,  "It is well known that Caner became a US citizen in 1978."

Well known? 

June 24, 2004, Ergun published an article on World Net Daily entitled, HATRIOTISM' & MICHAEL MOORE: TURKISH MUSLIM SAYS 'FAHRENHEIT 911' WRONG ON LIBERATION OF IRAQ

"I am a Persian Turkish immigrant raised as a Sunni Muslim, and in the interest of full disclosure, I must state that I left Islam in 1982, and became an American citizen."

This statement was repeated when Ergun published another article on Crosswalk, 25 days later, July 19, 2004, entitled more simply: Michael Moore and "Hatriotism"

Here he repeated:

"I am a Persian Turkish immigrant raised as a Sunni Muslim, and in the interest of full disclosure, I must state that I left Islam in 1982, the same year I became an American citizen."

Again, Ergun, himself, wrote at least twice in 2004 that he became a citizen in 1982.  He stated this was a part of fully disclosing his conflict of interests.  How can it both be "well known" that Ergun became a citizen in 1978 and "in the interest of full disclosure" that he became a citizen in 1982?

In fact does not both the 1978 and 1982 dates sound a little odd?

Ergun turned 12, November 3, 1978.  Did Ergun really become a US Citizen at the age of 11 or 12?  While not impossible, he seems rather young.  Ergun turned 16, November 3, 1982.  While possible, did Ergun really become a US Citizen at the age of 15 or 16?

It seems more likely that Ergun would become a citizen as an adult, after his eighteenth birthday, November 3, 1984.

"Caner was born in Stockholm, Sweden, became an American citizen in 1984 and a born-again Christian in 1982."

 In fact, The Free Lance -- Star reported August 2, 2003 that Ergun received his citizenship in 1984. 

So we have one year provided by Norman, which he says it was "well known" that Ergun gained his citizenship as a preteen. 

We have another year, printed by Ergun himself, that says he gained his citizenship around 15 or 16.

We have yet another year reported by a newspaper that says Ergun gained his citizenship near adulthood in 1984.

I think it is safe to say that it is not in any way "well known" when Ergun received his citizenship.  It is also pretty safe to say that Norman seems to call Ergun a liar; because Ergun himself wrote multiple times that he received his citizenship in 1982. 

So who do you think is telling the truth?

Unedited sources for the video clips
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M
http://evangelism.fbcpearlcity.com/media/msg-dr-caner.mov
http://library.ggbts.edu/Chapel/Missions/2010-2-13_MIssionsConference_CultureClash_PM-Evening-PlenarySession_DrErgunCaner.mp3

Norman Geisler's comments
http://www.normangeisler.net/articles/ErgunCaner/

Three articles written by Ergun Caner in 2004 where he claims to have become a citizen in 1982.
http://www.wnd.com/2004/06/25245/
http://jewishworldreview.com/0604/hate-riotism.php3
http://www.crosswalk.com/1274146/

The Free Lance Star that wrote that Ergun received his citizenship in 1984
http://news.google.com/newspapers?sjid=0QgGAAAAIBAJ&pg=6928,333707&dq=ergun+caner+1984&id=cTMzAAAAIBAJ

Music: Tuba Waddle,  Rags 2 Riches, and Green Leaves all provided by audionautix.com

Cited Links

Tim Lee's statements
http://fbcjaxwatchdog.blogspot.com/2011/05/after-11-months-liberty-university.html

September 25, 2010 article where Ergun says he did not lie.
http://www2.newsadvance.com/news/2010/sep/25/caner-defends-background-bristol-speech-ar-524525/

The unedited Marine videos on Viddler
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/2/
http://www.viddler.com/explore/jsin/videos/1/

Unedited Marine Videos on Youtube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxmIMR1LNos
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpDm3Z9tI-M

Ergun Caner's Apology
http://sbctoday.com/2010/02/25/statement-from-dr-ergun-caner/

Norman Geisler's statements
http://www.normangeisler.net/insupportofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/infurtherdefenseofcaner.html
http://www.normangeisler.net/indefenseofcaner.html